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Post by Necronomfive on Feb 27, 2005 11:50:19 GMT -5
Hello folks! I have just recently discovered this great site, and i must say i´m really excited to see you guys here, who made my childhood extraordinary, talking freely about your experiences from a time, when computer development was still a magical new world to be explored. If you don´t mind, i´d really like to ask Jonathan a few questions, since he is one of my favourite C64 composers. They sometimes may perhaps sound a little bit geeky, so please forgive... ;D - Which platform was your favourite to explore/compose songs for? - Do you have a song which is your personal favourite? - How was the atmosphere at Ocean back in those days? Was there some kind of competition/pressure between the different composers? - When developing music, what is/are your source/s of inspiration ? - How are you seeing your work of the old days on the old machines (C64 etc.) now in retrospective ? -What was your biggest challenge you had to face back at Ocean? - (Geek alarm) I noticed that in Total Recall on the C64, you use a special waveform combination which can only be heard on those late C64 models which can not reproduce digi sounds. Was this intentional or purely coincidence? ;D Thanks for looking, i hope this was not too annoying...
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Post by Jonathan Dunn on Feb 28, 2005 6:48:35 GMT -5
Hi,
Here's a few answers for you then...
- Which platform was your favourite to explore/compose songs for?
Definitely the 64 as that's what I started out on and also becuase I coded my own drivers. Never got round to doing it on the spectrum/amstrad. Later I did enjoy working on the SNES, hich I coded my own driver for to.
- Do you have a song which is your personal favourite?
Of the 64 stuff it would be Total Recall.
- How was the atmosphere at Ocean back in those days? Was there some kind of competition/pressure between the different composers?
Not at all, we often worked together doing different platform conversions.
- When developing music, what is/are your source/s of inspiration ?
Usually a few good noises gets me going.
- How are you seeing your work of the old days on the old machines (C64 etc.) now in retrospective ?
Quite funny to think that there's people out there remixing and reproducing the work. If you'd told me that 15 years ago I'd of laughed you out of the building.
-What was your biggest challenge you had to face back at Ocean?
Probably recording Gary Bracey for the free audio tape that went with DT's Olymipic Challenge.
ch ch ch challenge.......
- (Geek alarm) I noticed that in Total Recall on the C64, you use a special waveform combination which can only be heard on those late C64 models which can not reproduce digi sounds. Was this intentional or purely coincidence?
Purely coincidence.
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Post by Necronomfive on Feb 28, 2005 11:57:42 GMT -5
Hi Jon, thanks for answering my questions so far! Definitely the 64 as that's what I started out on and also becuase I coded my own drivers. Never got round to doing it on the spectrum/amstrad. Later I did enjoy working on the SNES, hich I coded my own driver for to. Cool, was there anything special (apart from being your first computer) about the C64 and the SID which you liked? And is my impression correct that Keith and Matthew also used your driver code? Whoa, that´s really a surprise! Because personally, I would have bet that either Platoon or Robocop would be your favourite. I think Total Recall stands out for its heavy use of the filter to create a smooth yet strong sound, although a little bit repetitive. My personal impression is that in most of your music you were doing for movie games you were aiming at not just doing a conversion of the soundtrack, but instead go for something which does capture the feeling of the movie´s "theme". Is there perhaps a music piece which you are most unsatisfied with? Yes, i can imagine... It´s funny that the older computer games, which were back in the past considered a lower form of entertainment for kiddies(compared to music and movies), have made such a strong impact on many people. If someone would have told me back then that 15 years later I am sitting here talking to you about your work, i also would not have believed it. ;-) I have the feeling that in many cases, there was much more to it than just doing your work you were supposed to, elevating it to some kind of art form. Would you agree with this concerning your work back then? Have a nice day Necronomfive
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Post by Paulie on Feb 28, 2005 13:33:46 GMT -5
There were a couple of 64 drivers - Just after Martin left he did some Freelance work for us (Combat School and Rastan) which used his new driver. From '87-'90 Jon, Matt, Gari and Keith all used a driver I wrote (and Jon and Gari specced out) - stuff like the Ocean loader music, Robocop, Navy Seals and Vindicator etc used it.
It was mainly written for size and processing time - Robocop used the 4th channel sample player for the first time, then Vindicator used the full blown 4th channel sampled drum sequencer.
Jon then did his own (jolly nice) driver with a much improved sequencer that replaced mine.
Jon could just rattle out tunes - I've still no idea how he got half the sounds he got out of that chip. He came up with the "a la Hubbard" drums which I implemented - no idea why it sounded like a Simmonds SynDrum - but it did!!!
- Paulie.
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Post by Gary on Feb 28, 2005 16:45:26 GMT -5
It's worth remembering that in most cases, when we licensed a movie, the music rights were not included. This meant Jon, Dean, Barry, Keith, etc had to compose soundtrack music from scratch.
They always did a fantastic job and in many cases, surpassed the original in terms of appropriateness of sound for the game.
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Post by Mark Jones Junior on Feb 28, 2005 17:34:41 GMT -5
I recall sitting down the hall from Jon hearing him compose his choons. You'd hear the same bit over and over again but it never became annoying. Then you'd have to go down and have a proper listen cos most of them were so good. Then you'd go get the bus home and find yaself whistling some little melody then realise it was one of Jon's!
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Post by Necronomfive on Feb 28, 2005 17:58:38 GMT -5
Hehe, my first encounter with Jon was Rococop. The title music really blew me away, because it almost sounded like the C64 had a real singing voice, and at the end, the whole piece slowed down and kind of "breathed" away... I made a recording on tape, being able to hear it at school. Hilarious to read later from different people on the internet, who did exactly the same thing with their favourite songs on the C64. It´s funny, but i personally think that in many cases, C64 games became classics not for their gameplay but just because of their fantastic music. I think it is also kind of sad that in the later years (SNES, etc.), the credits of the makers were not displayed anymore on the title screen. It would be very interesting to make a list someday and reveal who was responsible. Btw., in case you would like to to refresh your memory, www.hvsc.c64.org might be a cool place to look at. It´s the largest and most complete music collection ever done for a computer system (nearly 30000 songs now). They are also looking for the original authors who might be willing to make comments/corrections/additions etc. concerning their songs.
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Post by Mark Jones Junior on Feb 28, 2005 18:07:58 GMT -5
I think it is also kind of sad that in the later years (SNES, etc.), the credits of the makers were not displayed anymore on the title screen. It would be very interesting to make a list someday and reveal who was responsible. Yeah i just fired up 'Addams Family' on the SNES and would have liked to have seen who was involved. It just says 'Ocean', no names are listed. So who did work on it? What would the credits have been? Simon? It really rings a bell and while I don't remember owning it I reckon I may have had it on the Amiga. Is the Amiga version the same as the SNES?
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Post by Necronomfive on Feb 28, 2005 18:22:15 GMT -5
It really rings a bell and while I don't remember owning it I reckon I may have had it on the Amiga. Is the Amiga version the same as the SNES? Yup, it lacks all the fancy parallax scrolling, and the sound is not as good as the SNES version, but it´s definately the same game.
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Post by Paulie on Feb 28, 2005 18:25:03 GMT -5
IIRC Addams Family was;
BJ on Code Warren Lancashire on design and art Simon on the Sprites Jon on sound and music.
I think the Amiga was almost identical to the SNES.
On the music front its also worth remembering that the guys had to not only compose the audio and sounds, but physically type it all into the driver source code - working out things like the copious pitch bend timings by hand. Listening the same phrase over and over to "debug" it. It must have been soooo tedious, but they just blasted the tunes out (and generally on the 64 in between 4K and 8K including the driver code)
Some of Jon's stuff was a work of art - you got one hell of a lot of music for the few K you gave him.
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Post by K-J N. on Feb 28, 2005 18:42:35 GMT -5
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Post by JamesHiggins on Feb 28, 2005 19:57:42 GMT -5
or you can put in the code #Z6D? It'll jump straight to the end-credits (can't believe I still remember that code)
Also a bad bug - enter 11111 and you start the game with 99 lives. Woops.
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Post by Gary on Mar 1, 2005 1:59:34 GMT -5
It's odd to think that if you compare that with games of today, the credits would be literally dozens (in some cases, hundreds) of names in those credits.
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Mat
New Member
Posts: 19
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Post by Mat on Mar 1, 2005 8:26:27 GMT -5
I was a big fan of 64 music before I approached Ocean. I loved Martin's work. So for me, starting at Ocean was like giving a fanboy all the things he ever wanted! I realize now that I was tremendously lucky to have had the opportunity.
I hadn't heard anything by Jon before starting at Ocean, but I quickly realized how far he had begun to stretch the SID. There were so many features in the later drivers - such as triggering a note with an alternative waveform for a couple of frames, and Jon's waveform/filter switching thing (Untouchables titles) - that added to the Ocean sound.
Jon taught me a great deal - I was fresh out of school and he was very patient with me! There was a lot of ground to cover, and lots of toys to play with. I remember Paul's player was a bit of a revelation, as before that I had used some pretty terrible off-the-shelf products to make SID tunes; and it was only when Paul dug-out Martin's old player that I appreciated the significant leap in legibility/usability that Paul and Jon's players delivered!
I had such a great time making the music. Thanks to Jon and Paul.
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Post by Gary on Mar 1, 2005 8:32:02 GMT -5
. .I had such a great time making the music. Thanks to Jon and Paul. It's a shame you joined after George and Ringo had left...
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